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LiveVegan

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JKM JKM TAS Posts: 58
1 28 Jan 2013
I like a page on Facebook Called "LiveVegan" & lately I've been seeing them posting about Animals Australia. Here's the lastest post:

Why doesn't animal "protection" organisation "Animals Australia" promote veganism (the rejection of all forms of animal use) instead of this frivolous "Australia Day" campaign titled "Everyone deserves a day off" where they ask the public to take the day off (maybe even Monday too) from not eating flesh?

UVE archives addresses this issue: "Making a killing with welfare reform" http://uvearchives.wordpress.com/2011/09/22/making-a-killing-with-animal-welfare-reform/ and numerous essays on single issue campaigns http://uvearchives.wordpress.com/category/single-issue-campaigns/

The following information accompanies Animals Australia's "Everyone deserves a day off" campaign poster:

============
"Happy Australia Day! Whether you're celebrating with a meal today or on Monday - or both! - everyone deserves a day off.

Because just one reason to take your mates off your plate on Australia Day is that little lambs never did anything to you - except be ridiculously cute and entertaining: http://bit.ly/TzIIKl

www.EveryoneDeservesADayOff.com"

============

Would we ask the public to take a day off from abusing and murdering children? Of course not. So why do we think it's morally acceptable to suggest to the public they take a day or two off from participating in the torture and murder of one species? Why not ask them to end their use of animals for food, clothing, entertainment and any reason from now on? Why not ask them to be vegan?

Please promote veganism and veganism only. Anything less than veganism is violence. Not vegan? Please start here http://www.VeganKit.com/"
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I really want to comment, but my social anxiety is stopping me.

But am I the only one that disagrees with them? Of course Animals Australia would like everyone to go vegan. But you're not going to get to that point by being so extreme.

PETA ends up turning people AWAY from vegetarianism/veganism because of how extreme they are.

I like how Animals Australia is promoting veganism in a way that non vegans feel they could handle. People are more likely to go vegetarian/vegan for one day than for life. SOMETHING is better than NOTHING.

LiveVegan makes me feel guilty for not being vegan. People don't like being guilty, which causes them to become ignorant. Animals Australia makes me feel good for being vegetarian. It makes me feel supported. It makes me feel like I could be vegan. I honestly want to unlike LiveVegan.

I know not all will agree with me. But something is better than nothing. & I think ANimals Australia is doing a great job.
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Hi-Jinks Hi-Jinks VIC Posts: 19
2 28 Jan 2013
I agree with you. I think Animals Australia have the right approach, it's not so pushy and brash, which makes people actually stop and think about rather than immediately reject the idea.
And as you said, nobody likes being made to feel guilty. Guilting people into veganism obviously hasn't been the most successful method in the past.

If they're making you feel bad because of your current eating habits, I'd unlike them. Especially when all of Animals Australia and Unleashed are here to be supportive ^-^
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follz follz NSW Posts: 105
3 29 Jan 2013
Jessica Karli said:
But am I the only one that disagrees with them? Of course Animals Australia would like everyone to go vegan. But you're not going to get to that point by being so extreme.
Can I ask why you consider veganism extreme, or are you talking about LV?

Jessica Karli said:
PETA ends up turning people AWAY from vegetarianism/veganism because of how extreme they are.
PETA turn people away because of self-aggrandizing, sexist publicity stunts with the sole goal of grabbing headlines and expanding their donor base. Nothing more. PETA are to animal rights (or veganism) as a weapons manufacturer are to peace.

To quote one of their 'leaders': half of their members are vegetarian the other half think it's a good idea. That should give you an idea of who actually supports PETA.

Jessica Karli said:
I like how Animals Australia is promoting veganism in a way that non vegans feel they could handle. People are more likely to go vegetarian/vegan for one day than for life. SOMETHING is better than NOTHING.
AA, also, do not promote veganism (the entire section of their 'Take Action' tab contains precisely zero mentions of veganism). Outside of blink-and-you'll-miss-it mentions of it on their webpage or some of their website add campaigns (if at all), they stay well away from such a frightening, harrowing concept.

Jessica Karli said:
LiveVegan makes me feel guilty for not being vegan. People don't like being guilty, which causes them to become ignorant. Animals Australia makes me feel good for being vegetarian. It makes me feel supported. It makes me feel like I could be vegan. I honestly want to unlike LiveVegan.
You feel guilty because you have a moral concern for other animals Jessica. That's great! From what I can gather from what you have written, my view is that you are looking for someone to assuage your guilt because you are not a vegan for which AA is only all but happy to oblige.

I understand that you feel the need for recognition for being vegetarian and I know a lot of people like that, too. I will say this to you though: this isn't about you and I. Not at all. This about them. As much as some would love to (and do) make it about themselves, we need to remember that we are not the ones in the slaughterhouses. This is about the very least of what we owe morally to other animals and, if you agree with that, veganism is the only logical and morally consistent position to take.

I know, it may not have been what you were wanting to hear, but it is the truth. AA will not tell you that - they are an organisation on the constant lookout for potential donors whether they be vegan, vegetarian or anything else. If you feel you may not be ready, there are many ways to become vegan in time - one is to start by making one meal per day completely vegan. When you feel comfortable with that, move onto the next meal and before you know it... you'll be where you want to be and wondering why you thought it be difficult/daunting in the first place happy (not to mention wishing you had done it sooner)

If you need any help or advice, feel free to PM me wink
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Mary6 Mary6 NSW Posts: 152
4 29 Jan 2013
I also don't agree with them I think animals aus is alot less pushy and alot more supportive of people whereas just listening to them saying you have to be vegan! Is really rude and annoying! And I find it very offensive! I don't disagree that being vegan is one of the best things you can do to help animals but the way they put it makes it sound bad just to be vege! Also I think they should work together with other animal rights groups and support them not criticize and offend them be oz that will only cause hatred and the more people the more we can do! I am going to express how annoyed I am with them!
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Anthony Anthony WA Posts: 216
5 29 Jan 2013
I'd agree on some points with Follz. Language is really powerful, so we need to be mindful about saying veganism is "extreme" - we should instead be pointing out how easy it is and giving the message that being vegan is just an everyday thing which anyone can do. Because that's exactly what it is. wink

But in terms of your original post, about how to reply to people on LiveVegan - don't sweat it. The community there has already made the great decision to become vegan, so they're already on board. It's the overwhelming majority of people who presently don't give a second thought to animals that need your time and effort.

I know from my own experience people who think vegans eat eggs, or that we eat only soy and lettuce, or that pronounce the word "vaygun" - that's how unaware they are of the concept. THOSE are the people who you should be engaging with.

And as Follz suggests - there are several ways to make a transition to veganism even easier than it already is (http://www.unleashed.org.au/change_the_world/go_veg/how_to_tips.php), so have a go at it for yourself - and then share the love with your friends and family who maybe have never considered the idea before!

Have fun!!
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JKM JKM TAS Posts: 58
6 29 Jan 2013
follz said:
Jessica Karli said:
But am I the only one that disagrees with them? Of course Animals Australia would like everyone to go vegan. But you're not going to get to that point by being so extreme.
Can I ask why you consider veganism extreme, or are you talking about LV?

Jessica Karli said:
PETA ends up turning people AWAY from vegetarianism/veganism because of how extreme they are.
PETA turn people away because of self-aggrandizing, sexist publicity stunts with the sole goal of grabbing headlines and expanding their donor base. Nothing more. PETA are to animal rights (or veganism) as a weapons manufacturer are to peace.

To quote one of their 'leaders': half of their members are vegetarian the other half think it's a good idea. That should give you an idea of who actually supports PETA.

Jessica Karli said:
I like how Animals Australia is promoting veganism in a way that non vegans feel they could handle. People are more likely to go vegetarian/vegan for one day than for life. SOMETHING is better than NOTHING.
AA, also, do not promote veganism (the entire section of their 'Take Action' tab contains precisely zero mentions of veganism). Outside of blink-and-you'll-miss-it mentions of it on their webpage or some of their website add campaigns (if at all), they stay well away from such a frightening, harrowing concept.

Jessica Karli said:
LiveVegan makes me feel guilty for not being vegan. People don't like being guilty, which causes them to become ignorant. Animals Australia makes me feel good for being vegetarian. It makes me feel supported. It makes me feel like I could be vegan. I honestly want to unlike LiveVegan.
You feel guilty because you have a moral concern for other animals Jessica. That's great! From what I can gather from what you have written, my view is that you are looking for someone to assuage your guilt because you are not a vegan for which AA is only all but happy to oblige.

I understand that you feel the need for recognition for being vegetarian and I know a lot of people like that, too. I will say this to you though: this isn't about you and I. Not at all. This about them. As much as some would love to (and do) make it about themselves, we need to remember that we are not the ones in the slaughterhouses. This is about the very least of what we owe morally to other animals and, if you agree with that, veganism is the only logical and morally consistent position to take.

I know, it may not have been what you were wanting to hear, but it is the truth. AA will not tell you that - they are an organisation on the constant lookout for potential donors whether they be vegan, vegetarian or anything else. If you feel you may not be ready, there are many ways to become vegan in time - one is to start by making one meal per day completely vegan. When you feel comfortable with that, move onto the next meal and before you know it... you'll be where you want to be and wondering why you thought it be difficult/daunting in the first place happy (not to mention wishing you had done it sooner)

If you need any help or advice, feel free to PM me wink
Oh, sorry I didn't mean veganism was extreme! I meant LiveVegan were being very extreme about it!

& I agree with what you're saying about PETA. They seem to do more damage than good. :/

Oh I guess AA themselves don't promote veganism, their campaign was promoting vegetariansim. & I I feel like they do promote it with the forums on Unleashed, but that's a bit different.

But they're still working towards making life better for animals in ways that people who aren't interested in veganism can still do. My point was small steps are better than none!

Also, I know I feel guilty because I know eating dairy & eggs are wrong. It feels wrong to me. I am just finding it so hard. I've been trying to be vegan for a few years now. Not only am I struggling with being vegans, but I'm currently struggling with food in general. I just really need help & support & I don't know what to do.  ashamed2


Anthony said:
I'd agree on some points with Follz. Language is really powerful, so we need to be mindful about saying veganism is "extreme" - we should instead be pointing out how easy it is and giving the message that being vegan is just an everyday thing which anyone can do. Because that's exactly what it is. wink

But in terms of your original post, about how to reply to people on LiveVegan - don't sweat it. The community there has already made the great decision to become vegan, so they're already on board. It's the overwhelming majority of people who presently don't give a second thought to animals that need your time and effort.

I know from my own experience people who think vegans eat eggs, or that we eat only soy and lettuce, or that pronounce the word "vaygun" - that's how unaware they are of the concept. THOSE are the people who you should be engaging with.

And as Follz suggests - there are several ways to make a transition to veganism even easier than it already is (http://www.unleashed.org.au/change_the_world/go_veg/how_to_tips.php), so have a go at it for yourself - and then share the love with your friends and family who maybe have never considered the idea before!

Have fun!!
This probably sounds silly but I'm currently pregnant & I tend to overreact & get emotional about things. For some reason LiveVegan's post really got to me lol.

I'll be having a baby real soon & the idea of going vegan feels too overwhelming. I just feel like I constantly have excuses, but I think people will agree that having a newborn is overwhelming by itself.

But I am lactose intolerant, & my baby probably will be too, so it's probably going to be the best time to go vegan (health wise anyway) because I will be breastfeeding.

I am just so overwhelmed right now. I really want to be vegan. I really do. I just find it so hard. sad
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KirstyGirl KirstyGirl TAS Posts: 754
7 29 Jan 2013
If you're already veg and you're lactose intolerant what are you struggling with? Just eggs?
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JKM JKM TAS Posts: 58
8 29 Jan 2013
No I'm lactose intolerant & eat dairy anyway. I feel like crap most of the time. You think that would be enough to stop me, but no. I actually find it easy to not eat eggs.
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