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Considering most go hand in hand with ROUNDUP

1 - 4 of 4 posts

Casper.s2 Casper.s2 SA Posts: 1640
1 30 Jan 2014
We know what a pesticide is.... it is an animal killing toxin.

We know that plants get pests most often when the plants themselves,
are in a vulnerable state. When they are malformed or deteriated.

We know plants are tampered with chemically, at a DNA level.
To change the genetic information of the seed, the plant, the species... THE FOOD.

We know this is done so that the plants are resistant to being RoundUp smothered. We know "Round Up Ready" is the class of GMO Wheat, grown in Australia.

We know Round Up.... Will be used by those companies who grow GMO plants.

Is it Vegan... to eat something, we know has caused the deaths of animals?

If it is Vegan... what about food coloring agent E120 (carmine)....

Is this only non-Vegan, because we are directly consuming crushed up Cochineal Beetles, by consuming products that contain this red coloring.

Or is is non-Vegan, because the insects have died as a direct result of the product, we have invested money into. Thus supported the actions taken by the "Farmer".

?~?huh wave starfish

Casper.s2 Casper.s2 SA Posts: 1640
2 30 Jan 2014
also does this concept sound fair? The term ~ is Organic.

A pyrethrum daisy might be organic, even the pyrethrum spray from it (~derived from living matter) but if it was a pesticide (bug+kill), it would not be Vegan, nor would the crop it was used on be Organic (~produced without pesticides). pyrethrum spray happens to be a deterrent.

JayT JayT VIC Posts: 525
3 31 Jan 2014
Are you Vegan yet, Casper.s2?
You probably have never updated your profile, but it still says you wear leather and eat honey.

Of course E120 isn't Vegan, it comes from an animal, it is an animal product.

If I understand correctly, you're also saying that because farmers kill animals/insects in the production of plant foods, that it may not be Vegan?

If that's the case, you're going into a very grey area.
The only way you can ever know for sure that nothing was killed during the production, is to grow it yourself.
If you buy from an organic farmer who swears they kill no animals, some may still die during the transportation of the produce, or what ever.

Not everyone is perfect. Some people have to buy ordinary produce. They are still Vegan as long as they're not obviously eating animal products.

Casper.s2 Casper.s2 SA Posts: 1640
4 31 Jan 2014
I suppose not all GMO foods are for the use of toxins and I suppose taking the habitat for farming has already killed all the wild animal life anyway.

" The median half-life of glyphosate in soil ranges between 2 and 197 days; a typical field half-life of 47 days has been suggested. Soil and climate conditions affect glyphosate's persistence in soil. The median half-life of glyphosate in water varies from a few days to 91 days.[20]

According to the National Pesticide Information Center fact sheet, Glyphosate is not included in compounds tested for by the Food and Drug Administration's Pesticide Residue Monitoring Program, nor in the United States Department of Agriculture's Pesticide Data Program, however a field test showed that lettuce, carrots, and barley contained glyphosate residues up to one year after the soil was treated with 3.71 pounds of glyphosate per acre. "

"A recent study by eminent oncologists Dr. Leonard Hardell and Dr. Mikael Eriksson of Sweden, has revealed clear links between one of the world’s biggest selling herbicide, glyphosate (commonly known as Roundup, marketed by Monsanto), to non-Hodgkins lymphoma, a form of cancer - NHL. There are even requests for permits for higher residues on genetically engineered foods because they are highly resistant to herbicides, instead of reducing herbicide use, glyphosate resistant crops may result in increased residues. They are already on sale. Farmers knowing that their crop will tolerate or resist being killed off by the herbicides will tend to use them more liberally. There have been no risk/benefit analysis carried out, so the regulatory authorities have failed to implement the precautionary principle with respect to GMOs."

Well.... I still havn't bought any new Leather shoes if that is what you're asking.
I'm still glad I didn't throw them in the bin for the sake of a title.
(side note: shoes were from salvos and went through 5 synthetic pairs at the same time.)

Being minimalistic also means not being wasteful.

And I avoid Honey now, but will still very Occasionally Drink Mead.
I emailed Maxwell's and the Wine Maker Proudly responded,
that they do not use animal products like dairy or egg. Which isn't as common as most think.

With the amount of research I diligently do I am pretty much certain,
I willingly drink Mead, less than the average Vegan accidentally eats/uses animal.

Mead is the oldest known fermented drink to man kind,
on the wedding, the vikings drank so much... the moon light,
became the light of celebrating long into the night.

Hence Honeymoon.

I still need convincing, about Honey. I also Love Bees... so.

But if I'm at a restaurant, I have to be 'Vegan', because I am in every respect,
of the dining out term.

I'm pretty confident that the way in which animals are exploited in our degenerate society is the issue, not the product itself.


ah but you see, what is the difference between beetles being killed for color, or being killed for existing? (both unnecessarily) and if there is a certainty, should there not be a reciprocal action for an absolute thing, such as 'veganism'. I think it isn't a grey area at all. Sure if I had to choose being poisoned to death because someone hates me, or chopped to death with a shovel by someone who loves me, i'd rather choose neither. But considering the impact of one vs the other. My death would only be in vain, if being poisoned. Because the people do not gain from this. Nor the hater...sure he gets money, but what is it worth in a world where there is nothing beautiful to trade it for anymore (humans having absolutely taken that path into the future)?

if Veganism is purely dietary, I would say that I am NOT VEGAN. Because I could not happily eat SOYA or support companies who harm animals to cover their own liabilities, without any real justification for doing so.

For example. Myself feeling humans are intelligent enough to theoretically derive the outcome of using chemicals in the human system, through pure modelling (with enough information), but simply we do not have the understanding. I mean we are capable, but crippled by the same thing that causes us to take short-cuts and half-measures. Stupid actions, Stupid consequences.

But if we don't have the understanding to trial chemicals for human and animal use, in theoretical modelling. If we aren't smart enough to be able to turn the human body into an equation... then how does this shortfall then elicit Practicing Human Trials.

We are obviously too stupid to even deserve the desired gain?
Especially when the desired gain is not intelligence, wisdom or understanding.

I value the Wild Nature, as much as any person should. Which is too much for me to support Farmer's, Middle Men and a Government that profits from annihilation of native eco-systems and habitat. I suggest if they must do that to survive (which is a lie), they are not native, to the nation, the land or the country nor have they been naturalized to the way of life of that place.
Nor have they found how to coexist, in symbiosis or in preserving areas from their nature...(not because they are incapable, but because their greed is greater than their compassion).

I avoid Soya completely, if a product might have Palm Oil...I make a case by case judgement.
That is how bad I think Soya is... and I know a little about Malaysia/Indonesia deforestation (a little, not a lot). Or maybe i've seen one too many Beautiful Amazon Rainforest Documentaries, to be able to stomach it. (I avoided it from Day one of taking on Veganism/A more morally suiting diet ~as I call it).