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Pet food

A little help please.

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Contreras Contreras NSW Posts: 349
31 9 Feb 2011
wild child2 said:
kimberleyfrancess said:
wild child2 said:
Yvan said:
wild child2 said:
Thanks for the info.
Still rather feed my animals fresh vegetables, wholegrains and meat (including offal) than processed veganpet.
Thats fine with me, I just don't like when other people dismiss the idea when they see the words vegan cat or dog without doing any research happy.
I'm not against a vegan diet for dogs, but Veganpet is still a super processed food based on carbohydrates from soy & supplements. They say the reason nearly 1 in 2 dogs die from cancer is because of their unnatural simple carb rich diets.

Ever heard the sentence "supplements should not replace a balanced diet"

So if I was going to go vegan for my dogs I'd do it homemade as much as possible
Veganpet isn't the staple of my animals diet, they don't just receive the kibble and water. They also get homecooked meals.

Why do I feel like there are some people who are just hoping that my animals get sick to prove a point? Sure, this diet isn't right for everyone but for those who it is there isn't an issue. Just like feeding your dogs meat, if you don't make sure its ticking all the boxes you're going to be in trouble and noone wants their pet to suffer.

Chewie said:
But, as previously noted, many animals cannot actually live on a vegan diet. Period. No questions asked. If you feed a ferret a vegan diet, it will die.
I never said anything about ferrets being vegan. I know from experience that it is fine for my cats and dogs to be. In fact, up until yesterday I'd never even seen a ferret.  laugh I realise that some animals cannot cut out meat from their diets but cats and dogs can providing that you monitor their needs and do the appropriate research.
Of course I don't want your dogs to get sick Kimberly that is ridiculous...

I just wondered if they had received blood tests and all their levels were good merely out of genuine interest

I think it would be great if they are flourishing on a vegan diet, I just have my doubts on how healthy/natural it is for them. Hey, if your dogs had blood tests after an extended period of being fed veganpet and all was well I might even consider giving it it a go! happy

It just worries me that their digestive systems deal with plants differently to ours, what would be healthy and ample for a human vegan may not suffice for dog fed a vegan diet for example we can obtain enough iron from leafy greens and lentils/seeds etc but a dog's digestive system would not make use of the iron in these foods as efficiently as ours
That study I posted had vegan dog diets over 1 year ( average was around 4 I think) and they were said to be healthy except for the small percentage that was lacking in taurine. Most vegan dogs on that study were on home made meals.

I personally came to the conclusion that meat diets are safer and easier to maintain because a well balance vegan diet is just over the line of nutrients where as a not so good meat diet still gets enough which makes it not for everyone or every animal. When I rescue or adopt a dog/cat I will be trying a planned vegan diet with tests before and after and if the animal was unhealthy I would source a meat diet, I don't want them to be unhealthy if that was the case.
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wild child2 wild child2 QLD Posts: 2638
32 9 Feb 2011
Yvan said:
wild child2 said:
kimberleyfrancess said:
wild child2 said:
Yvan said:
wild child2 said:
Thanks for the info.
Still rather feed my animals fresh vegetables, wholegrains and meat (including offal) than processed veganpet.
Thats fine with me, I just don't like when other people dismiss the idea when they see the words vegan cat or dog without doing any research happy.
I'm not against a vegan diet for dogs, but Veganpet is still a super processed food based on carbohydrates from soy & supplements. They say the reason nearly 1 in 2 dogs die from cancer is because of their unnatural simple carb rich diets.

Ever heard the sentence "supplements should not replace a balanced diet"

So if I was going to go vegan for my dogs I'd do it homemade as much as possible
Veganpet isn't the staple of my animals diet, they don't just receive the kibble and water. They also get homecooked meals.

Why do I feel like there are some people who are just hoping that my animals get sick to prove a point? Sure, this diet isn't right for everyone but for those who it is there isn't an issue. Just like feeding your dogs meat, if you don't make sure its ticking all the boxes you're going to be in trouble and noone wants their pet to suffer.

Chewie said:
But, as previously noted, many animals cannot actually live on a vegan diet. Period. No questions asked. If you feed a ferret a vegan diet, it will die.
I never said anything about ferrets being vegan. I know from experience that it is fine for my cats and dogs to be. In fact, up until yesterday I'd never even seen a ferret.  laugh I realise that some animals cannot cut out meat from their diets but cats and dogs can providing that you monitor their needs and do the appropriate research.
Of course I don't want your dogs to get sick Kimberly that is ridiculous...

I just wondered if they had received blood tests and all their levels were good merely out of genuine interest

I think it would be great if they are flourishing on a vegan diet, I just have my doubts on how healthy/natural it is for them. Hey, if your dogs had blood tests after an extended period of being fed veganpet and all was well I might even consider giving it it a go! happy

It just worries me that their digestive systems deal with plants differently to ours, what would be healthy and ample for a human vegan may not suffice for dog fed a vegan diet for example we can obtain enough iron from leafy greens and lentils/seeds etc but a dog's digestive system would not make use of the iron in these foods as efficiently as ours
That study I posted had vegan dog diets over 1 year ( average was around 4 I think) and they were said to be healthy except for the small percentage that was lacking in taurine. Most vegan dogs on that study were on home made meals.

I personally came to the conclusion that meat diets are safer and easier to maintain because a well balance vegan diet is just over the line of nutrients where as a not so good meat diet still gets enough which makes it not for everyone or every animal. When I rescue or adopt a dog/cat I will be trying a planned vegan diet with tests before and after and if the animal was unhealthy I would source a meat diet, I don't want them to be unhealthy if that was the case.
It would be interesting to know what the homemade diet consisted of...
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Aimee Aimee VIC Posts: 957
33 3 Jul 2011
If anyone here feeds their dogs meat, what do you feed them?
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rottweiler rottweiler SA Posts: 1907
34 3 Jul 2011
I feed cargo meat.. He loves chicken, and beef, and lamb.. He'll eat absolutly everything.. I make him big giant stews with just a bag of frozen vegetables, a beef or chicken stock and put a bucket load of mince in it.. He eats any and all meats, i dont wanna deprive him of something he's supposed to eat.. happy
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OinkMoo OinkMoo NSW Posts: 1340
35 3 Jul 2011
Aimee said:
If anyone here feeds their dogs meat, what do you feed them?
dogs should be composed of 50% grains, which should ideally be boiled or steamed. This more closely matches semi-digested grains in the stomachs of the animals that dogs consume in the wild, which is an important part of their diet. The staple grain is usually brown rice, but other organic wholegrains such as oatmeal, barley, millet, corn or amaranth can also be added for variety. Vegetables should make up about 25% of the complete cooked diet and I also recommend boiling or steaming these lightly, then chopping them finely depending on the preference of the individual pet. Some larger dogs love their vegetables whole or raw and this is fine, while some smaller breeds may enjoy them made into more of a puree in a food processor. It is also fine to finely grate raw vegetables such as carrots or zucchini. Virtually all vegetables are acceptable, although favorites include carrots, broccoli, cauliflower, yellow squash, zucchini and Brussels sprouts.

The protein content should be also about 25% although some people prefer to feed higher, especially to young, active, working animals, pregnant females, and growing puppies. If the meat is organic and fresh it can be safely fed raw, which is the ideal. A healthy dog should have enough acid in the stomach to safely kill pathogenic bacteria. If the source of the meat is suspect it may be lightly steamed or boiled, and you may do this if you are nervous about feeding your dog raw meat, or if your dog is older or sick and tolerates lightly cooked meat better. I would not recommend feeding raw pork, because of parasites, and anyhow prefer beef, chicken turkey or rabbit as a protein source. Organ meats such as heart, liver or kidney can also be fed once or twice a week. Liver is very nutritious and large quantities are not required, or recommended because of the high levels of vitamin A but a small amount once or twice a week is a good addition to the diet. A large raw organic beef leg bone fed once a week is an excellent dietary addition and keeps your dogs teeth free of plaque and gum disease.

An occasional egg is also acceptable, and these can be fed raw or cooked, although some people prefer to remove the egg white when feeding them raw because this contains an enzyme which can denature biotin, an important B vitamin in the body. Personally I feed my dogs an occasional raw egg, just as they might scavenge in the wild, and have seen no problems from this, and they love it. Fish is also acceptable and this is also something that dogs, and other wild carnivores would eat in the wild if they had the opportunity to do so. The best way to measure the diet is to make mix 2 measures (such as a cup) of grains with one measure of vegetables and one measure of meat. It is also essential to add vitamins and minerals to the diet. Consult with a holistic veterinarian for specifics


sorry for the long post - i hope that helped happy
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Aimee Aimee VIC Posts: 957
36 3 Jul 2011
Thanks that was extremely helpful. My dog eats canned and refrigerated packaged dog foods at the moment.
Just....it feels SO AWKWARD buying meat off the shelf- like my conscience can't handle it (whereas when it's in a packet I don't really think about it, and that's what my Dad will buy regardless of what I say).
So I was thinking free range chicken mixed with grains and veggies- and your posts have been really helpful. Unfortunately my dog being vegan just isn't an option (so please, no one harass me!).
It could work out cheaper too, couldn't it? Rice is cheap, and perhaps $15 of FR chicken could last a week, with added frozen vegetables? Mind you he's a big dog (golden retriever x german shepherd).
ReplyQuote

OinkMoo OinkMoo NSW Posts: 1340
37 3 Jul 2011
Aimee said:
Thanks that was extremely helpful. My dog eats canned and refrigerated packaged dog foods at the moment.
Just....it feels SO AWKWARD buying meat off the shelf- like my conscience can't handle it (whereas when it's in a packet I don't really think about it, and that's what my Dad will buy regardless of what I say).
So I was thinking free range chicken mixed with grains and veggies- and your posts have been really helpful. Unfortunately my dog being vegan just isn't an option (so please, no one harass me!).
It could work out cheaper too, couldn't it? Rice is cheap, and perhaps $15 of FR chicken could last a week, with added frozen vegetables? Mind you he's a big dog (golden retriever x german shepherd).
thats ok, my dog is a st.bernard but becouse of her stomach problems ( she is 9 years old, whish sadley is old for her breed ) she cant handle meat or bones anymore , so she is a vegan dog now happy . also becouse of her diet it has made her so active now, she has never been this good befor tongue . but not all dogs can be vegan.

i think your suggestion above " Rice is cheap, and perhaps $15 of FR chicken could last a week, with added frozen vegetables" < that would be a good diet for your dog happy mix around his dinners so that he has a variety ecstatic
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xAshlee xAshlee TAS Posts: 722
38 3 Jul 2011
my Border collie has a non malignant cancerous lump on his nose that went down when i use to feed him vitamin supplements on diet including meat..... when off the supplements it grew back.

since feeding him home cooked vegan and bought vegan food it has gone right down again , hes back to a healthy weight [was fat before] , seems more alert & intelligent.....

still happy & loving the food. WHAT more can i say?!!!

remember Barney, the 27 YEAR OLD border collie, who was vegan =D his owner fed him rice, lentils & veggies. one of the oldest dogs in the world.

pretty good argument
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Aimee Aimee VIC Posts: 957
39 3 Jul 2011
That's great  clap happy
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Sakara Sakara QLD Posts: 13
40 7 Jul 2011
If you are looking for meat, we use The Complete Pet Company for our cats, and if I had non-Vegan dogs I'd use her for that too.
http://www.completepet.com.au/welcome.aspx
Jenny Golsby runs it. She uses free range, organic, human grade meat so your cats and dogs aren't getting dodgy grade food. She's based in Brisbane and delivers throughout Brisbane and the Gold Coast, I'm not sure about the rest of Australia though :/
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